Discussion about this post

User's avatar
Garreth Heidt's avatar

Let me say something about repetition and patterns. I spent 27 years as a coach and judge of HS Forensics. I've spent countless hours listening to students use 3 point analysis to explain why the US should continue to fund NASA (for example) and I've sat through countless debates on resolutions like, "Resolved: Civil Disobedience is a just response to oppressive government."

By and large, regardless of the topic or the resolution, students followed certain formats. In Debate (Lincoln Douglas debate) it was the Toulmin rhetorical method (Claims, Evidence, Warrants, Impacts) and in Extemporaneous, it was generally 3 point analysis organized around time, location, or hierarchy.

Over time, as a coach, my students became far more fluent and advanced in their rhetorical choices, and their choices were more agile, creative, and nimble.

But they could not have gotten there without first understanding these forms.

And yes, debate is a game with rather predictable patterns at the novice level. But at some point, with enough experience and real-world feedback, they make a huge cognitive leap.

Surely I'm not suggesting that all students should engage in the rigorous and often ridiculous event of HS Forensics, where some of the very best speeches I've ever seen are those that lampoon just how predictable their speeches are.

But I am suggesting that kids need lots and lots of practice and that understanding the importance of form as a scaffold is important...so long as we also understand we need to help them move away from this.

I've spent thousands of dollars and endless hours freewriting and revising work through attendance at Bard College's Institute for Writing and Thinking. I know how I write, and that knowledge is a debt I owe to Peter Elbow, who never taught the way most HS English teacher teach:

"The Teacherless Writing Class

According to Elbow, improving your writing has nothing to do with learning discrete skills or getting advice about what changes you need to make. This stuff doesn’t help. What helps is understanding how other people experience your work. Not just one person, but a few. You need to keep getting it from the same people so they get progressively better at transmitting their experiences while you get better at receiving them."

If what ChatGPT does is, as you and many here and elsewhere are saying, is force out those who profess forms and efficiencies over voice and engaging prose, then count me in. I'll put on my VR headset and lead the way to something more human, something unpredictable, something closer to our own truths in words.

Expand full comment
Laura Crossett's avatar

I confess a fondness for the five paragraph theme, but mostly only as a means of writing parodies of five paragraph essays. I don’t really want to teach again (through I did teach an online writing class a year ago), but I do think I’d do a much better job at 47 than I did at 24, in part because I’ve realized that writing is genuinely difficult for a lot of people—and that coming up with forms of writing that make sense as “writing one might actually be called upon to do in one’s actual life” is a better mode of approaching the whole business.

(Some day perhaps someone will decide I am qualified to teach seminars on How to Write a Work Email in addition to my dream job of of teaching people How to Run a Meeting.)

Expand full comment
39 more comments...

No posts